TR Replies
The hottest thread currently on TAY stars Jason Hummel and cascade hardman Sky both of whom are stars (along with Josh H) of the latest episode of the Fitz Cahall's Dirtbag Diaries (released last Friday) and available at
http://thedirtbag.libsyn.com/
(excuse me if this was posted somewhere else on the site)
The Crusade
True or False? Standard pushing is for the pros. If you want to shape skiing or climbing, you have to ditch the job, move into the car a...
http://thedirtbag.libsyn.com/
(excuse me if this was posted somewhere else on the site)
The Crusade
True or False? Standard pushing is for the pros. If you want to shape skiing or climbing, you have to ditch the job, move into the car a...
author=Jim Oker link=topic=10439.msg42391#msg42391 date=1214442943]
I don't think anyone but those who were there can know for sure either way whether Sky and Ryan were reckless or not, e.g. whether one ski cut at the top and avoiding a hard turn on the convexity was all that was indicated, or what. At least not w/o a lot more information than we have in this thread. Jason, however, was quite clear that he should not have turned off his brain to a...
author=Stugie link=topic=10439.msg42383#msg42383 date=1214427272]
I feel that this is reckless.
At the risk of beating a dead horse, I don't think anyone but those who were there can know for sure either way whether Sky and Ryan were reckless or not, e.g. whether one ski cut at the top and avoiding a hard turn on the convexity was all that was indicated, or what. At least not w/o a lot more information than we have in this th...
looking up at alpentalcorey's reply #42, I see he already expressed some of my thoughts much better--that of the expressed sentiments taking on meaning specific to the audience...
should've read the abundant posts more closely--lots of thought-provoking stuff above, including the analogies, pardon my reaction.
should've read the abundant posts more closely--lots of thought-provoking stuff above, including the analogies, pardon my reaction.
oh what the hell. while we're offering opinions (and drivel), here's mine: in the original post, actions were reported, and then some (not fully contextual) sentiments were expressed that were parsed and churned through the specula-tron. i appreciate the discussion, but some of these analogies are wandering FAR afield. passing on curves is not in the same category as managing risks in ski mountaineering. nor is war--maybe i just need to think harder.
re: immediately abov...
re: immediately abov...
<geekcameratalk>
It's a Canon S3-IS still camera. It does 640x480 30 fps video and uses AA batteries like my headlamp. I buy lithium AAs in bulk. They are light, last a long time, and aren't affected by cold.
The current model is the S5-IS, and there is rumor of a S6 coming soon with HD-quality video.
</geekcameratalk>
It's a Canon S3-IS still camera. It does 640x480 30 fps video and uses AA batteries like my headlamp. I buy lithium AAs in bulk. They are light, last a long time, and aren't affected by cold.
The current model is the S5-IS, and there is rumor of a S6 coming soon with HD-quality video.
</geekcameratalk>
Good one, Stugie. I first heard a variation of that allegory (told to me in the form of a joke) when discussing the issue of advertent exposure to alpine risks about a decade ago. In my view, it and Lowell's Passing on Curves allegory, although different -- Lowell's addresses advertent exposure to risk, while Stugie's is more about fatalism -- are directly germane to the discussion that has emerged on this thread.
Lowell is right on the mark when he responds to Sky&...
Lowell is right on the mark when he responds to Sky&...
In reading this ongoing dialogue, there is a lot of discussion about Sky's quote: "If it ain't worth dying for then you better find something else to do". I think some excellent points have been made, but something has been weighing more on my mind as this thread continues. I want to premise by saying I'm not pointing fingers, I'm just trying to highlight what in my opinion is an error we can learn from.
author=r...
Thanks Ron for the photos and link to the book on Rainier. Its always fun to have some historical context for places we enjoy so much...
Looking forward to getting out again soon!
Looking forward to getting out again soon!
I'm delighted that we got to hook up with your for some tours during your trip. Seeya next time.
That is awesome! Nice work!
+1 to Scotsman's and Lowell's respective posts re Twightism and Passing on Curves.
I share Scotsman’s contempt for Twight’s writing and shameless snobbery. Years ago, I read A Short Walk in the Hindu Kush, a delightfully understated narrative by Eric Newby, a fellow who had dropped out of the British fashion industry to explore the high country of Afghanistan. Twight’s exhibitionist macho missives and Newby’s humble account represent two ends of the spectrum of alpi...
I share Scotsman’s contempt for Twight’s writing and shameless snobbery. Years ago, I read A Short Walk in the Hindu Kush, a delightfully understated narrative by Eric Newby, a fellow who had dropped out of the British fashion industry to explore the high country of Afghanistan. Twight’s exhibitionist macho missives and Newby’s humble account represent two ends of the spectrum of alpi...
Nice pictures - way to get after it!
Full TR - http://www.leelau.net/2008/wedge2008_06_24/
There is a huge difference between acknowledging that when you go into the mountains you could die and saying that when you go into the mountains you’re embracing the idea of death. It’s always seemed to me that if you go into the mountains, no matter how “easy” the ones you pick are, you’d better think they’re worth dying for, because the fact is you might.
By far the vast majority of missions I go on as a member of search and rescue are for folks on non-technical terrain. I’ve b...
By far the vast majority of missions I go on as a member of search and rescue are for folks on non-technical terrain. I’ve b...
Cem,
Thank you, that's got me smiling. Now that's the way to travel.
Are you from the future? or just foreshadowing it?!
Cheers,
Nate
Thank you, that's got me smiling. Now that's the way to travel.
Are you from the future? or just foreshadowing it?!
Cheers,
Nate
Great photos, glad everyone had a good tour.
I'm pondering a couple of ideas.
4 more weeks in the cast for me. Be careful out there, there are...
author=ron j link=topic=10428.msg42337#msg42337 date=1214367420]
Nice trip planning, MadDog, what's next?
I'm pondering a couple of ideas.
author=snoseeker link=topic=10428.msg42165#msg42165 date=1214239611]
Next we get Jeanette back on two feet!!
4 more weeks in the cast for me. Be careful out there, there are...
Great photos. Thanks for sharing them.
When you first posted about your trip I wasn't sure how you were getting all your gear on the bike. Now I know. Quite an adventure....
When you first posted about your trip I wasn't sure how you were getting all your gear on the bike. Now I know. Quite an adventure....
That's awesome!!!
Thanks for sharing and providing new inspiration for next summer!
Thanks for sharing and providing new inspiration for next summer!
To me, the analogy doesn't really address what I saw as the best and most important part of Sky's post.
To further explain let me use an analogy. This is from my own life. About 10 years ago th...
author=skykilo link=topic=10439.msg42261#msg42261 date=1214322730]
Skiing is freedom, the mountains are freedom, and damn it all if I can't be a little loose with how I express my sentiments about these things.
To further explain let me use an analogy. This is from my own life. About 10 years ago th...
http://picasaweb.google.com/c777123/SkiCycle/photo#s5215695755618207666
http://picasaweb.google.com/c777123/SkiCycle/photo#s5215695755618207666
http://picasaweb.google.com/c777123/SkiCycle/photo#s5215695755618207666
here is some info about set up. thank you Zap.
Cem
MAY-JUNE 2008 SKI-CYCLE TOUR
CASCADE TO SIERRA ROAD TO ARGENTINA CHILE
NO CAR NO GAS
NO MONEY NO PROBLEM
ENJOY SKI CYCLE OUTDOOR AND FREEDOM
200...
http://picasaweb.google.com/c777123/SkiCycle/photo#s5215695755618207666
http://picasaweb.google.com/c777123/SkiCycle/photo#s5215695755618207666
here is some info about set up. thank you Zap.
Cem
MAY-JUNE 2008 SKI-CYCLE TOUR
CASCADE TO SIERRA ROAD TO ARGENTINA CHILE
NO CAR NO GAS
NO MONEY NO PROBLEM
ENJOY SKI CYCLE OUTDOOR AND FREEDOM
200...
St. Alphonzo,
No need to improvise.
http://www.bdel.com/gear/fl_whippet.php
I'm sure these things can be improvised, but with safety equipment I'll let someone else do the construction.
No need to improvise.
http://www.bdel.com/gear/fl_whippet.php
I'm sure these things can be improvised, but with safety equipment I'll let someone else do the construction.
Hello Dan,
I watched your movie about the Furher's Finger this morning before work. Thank you for the nice start to my day of remodeling a condo with a Maui ocean view. I went to another site to get some photos of where you actually were on the Mtn. Forgive me, I am not familiar with all the routes on Rainier.
Kelly Yakley, from Mt. Hood and I skied off the Rainier summit back in '79 or '80 It was somewhere on the North side. Not a steep decent, just fun. I do remember a...
I watched your movie about the Furher's Finger this morning before work. Thank you for the nice start to my day of remodeling a condo with a Maui ocean view. I went to another site to get some photos of where you actually were on the Mtn. Forgive me, I am not familiar with all the routes on Rainier.
Kelly Yakley, from Mt. Hood and I skied off the Rainier summit back in '79 or '80 It was somewhere on the North side. Not a steep decent, just fun. I do remember a...
Thanks for taking the dip, Sky.
When you say that everyone risks it all in the mountains, I think you must be referring to objective dangers. Since the subjective risks that different people undertake vary hugely, objective dangers are the only common denominator. Objective dangers are important and I don't think I considered them as much as I should have in my previous posts.
Still, I think objective dangers are a much smaller contributor to mountaineering accidents...
When you say that everyone risks it all in the mountains, I think you must be referring to objective dangers. Since the subjective risks that different people undertake vary hugely, objective dangers are the only common denominator. Objective dangers are important and I don't think I considered them as much as I should have in my previous posts.
Still, I think objective dangers are a much smaller contributor to mountaineering accidents...
Truly an amazing feat Zap! ;)
I headed up to the top of Alpental after work this evening (June 24th) via Edelweiss Bowl and was pleasantly surprised to find upper Nash still in (with a short ~15-ft easy downclimb/hike at the entrance). Nice to be rewarded with spectacular late evening corn at Alpental in the first week of summer! The moguls are still there, but quite subdued. A bit more suncupped on lower International, but fun turns all the way back to Sessel.&nbs...
I headed up to the top of Alpental after work this evening (June 24th) via Edelweiss Bowl and was pleasantly surprised to find upper Nash still in (with a short ~15-ft easy downclimb/hike at the entrance). Nice to be rewarded with spectacular late evening corn at Alpental in the first week of summer! The moguls are still there, but quite subdued. A bit more suncupped on lower International, but fun turns all the way back to Sessel.&nbs...
and Jason.. The mountains are not always friendly and the skies not always blue.. thats why i love them..
I don't think he made Marylanders look bad. Considering he'd never skinned before, he got pretty far up before pooping out (see below, arrow points to him at his highest point of ascent). His downhill technique may have left a little to be desired, but that's understandable... He was trying to figure out what the white stuff was, and where he could find some familiar ice.
It's actually funny; we'd skied together at Liberty before (you may notice my picture...
It's actually funny; we'd skied together at Liberty before (you may notice my picture...
author=Jason_H. link=topic=10439.msg42338#msg42338 date=1214367531]I did put myself out there by posting this, and I knew that when I did it. In posting so many trip reports over the years, I wanted to show the bad side, not just the blue-bird days and perfect snow.
Thank you for doing that.
And you've done a great job starting and maintaining an excellent dialogue. Even in a debating dialogue such as in this thre...
Alan, If we had skied our ascent route, the top 800-1000vf would have been fine but the remaining 600-700vf would have been rather sketchy. The lower section would have been tight trees with tree wells, debris and possible bare patches and stream crossings. The descent from the slot to the hairpin had variable conditions but was open and rather easy to avoid any hazards. We all agreed that we made the right choice. Plus an extra 700vf of descent.
Funny- I am also from Maryland and upon moving here became a year round skier. My friends still cannot comprehend the fact that I can ski year round and that we had powder in June. Wow, what a good place to live! Sure beats the hell out of 100 degree summer days in the DC area.
Hope your friend did not make us Marylanders look too bad, some of us can skin more than 1000 vert feet before crapping out :)
Chris
Hope your friend did not make us Marylanders look too bad, some of us can skin more than 1000 vert feet before crapping out :)
Chris
Jason I think you clarified your point beautifully and I wish I could express myself as well as you do. I agree with your clarification and you have my greatest respect. I thought there was some "Twightism" creeping into your philospohy but I was wrong and I apologize.
Scotsmen, my point of view seems to be missed. I've written a few times to clear it up, then erased.
I think what you wrote is great, and in no way am I saying that extreme is all there is. I am confused why many of you think I have said this??? But, no matter, the point is a good one to discuss. I have long battled the reasons why I ski the things I do. It is not because they are steep or difficult, rather it is because I like to climb and I like to ski. The two combined are wh...
I think what you wrote is great, and in no way am I saying that extreme is all there is. I am confused why many of you think I have said this??? But, no matter, the point is a good one to discuss. I have long battled the reasons why I ski the things I do. It is not because they are steep or difficult, rather it is because I like to climb and I like to ski. The two combined are wh...
Nice Mellow tour you guys. Very enjoyable.
Bonnie
and Marco
you certainly had your way with that corn.
More pictures posted HERE.
Nice trip planning, MadDog, what's next?
Marco, that book I mentioned tha...
Bonnie
and Marco
you certainly had your way with that corn.
More pictures posted HERE.
Nice trip planning, MadDog, what's next?
Marco, that book I mentioned tha...
Cool, Alan. Thanks again for the excellent report and help route finding. It was a fun day. Where to next?
Do you think that you missed the best skiing by not retracing your ascent?
Alan
Alan
I don't know you Jason or Sky and let me say I have the most tremendous respect for what you guys do and the trip reports you write. I have expressed concerns to some people in the past to people who know you like" I hope they don't push it too far" and their reply has always been that you guys are some of the best , safest mountaineers they have ever seen.
But, the problem I have with some of the quotes is the attitude that if it isn't extreme enough that y...
But, the problem I have with some of the quotes is the attitude that if it isn't extreme enough that y...
Erik,
It sounds like you guys ascended the way my son and I did last weekend. There also was another post which may have gone the same way which might have provided the boot path through the band, as we had done.
You were smart to descend that way as well, you got more vertical fun than my son and I did, but staying too close to the granite slabs below Liberty Bell. Nothing but tight steep trees and a stream gully there. Your first photo reveals this slope as ideal for...
It sounds like you guys ascended the way my son and I did last weekend. There also was another post which may have gone the same way which might have provided the boot path through the band, as we had done.
You were smart to descend that way as well, you got more vertical fun than my son and I did, but staying too close to the granite slabs below Liberty Bell. Nothing but tight steep trees and a stream gully there. Your first photo reveals this slope as ideal for...
A more complete photo story can be found here: http://www.telemarktips.com/photopost/showgallery.php?ppuser=20&cat=500
Great to see you up there too Andrew. Suprisingly we saw only two other groups of skiers all day: two early skining up and one comming down the chutes as we left the basin.
Hope you got some good turns in.
bobS
author=skierguitarist link=topic=10454.msg42304#msg42304 date=1214344690]
COOL!!!!!!!!! The video was good for my convalescening (sp?Help).
dictionary? :-)
My story was just that. It was writen without constraint. Warning is inherent to the story and the fear it is coupled with, and yes, thrill, too. We each find our own meanings in the written word, that is why poetry exists, etc.
'The word experience is like a shrapnel shell, and bursts into a thousand meanings.'
George Santayana
"It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer o...
'The word experience is like a shrapnel shell, and bursts into a thousand meanings.'
George Santayana
"It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer o...
author=Teleskichica link=topic=10439.msg42305#msg42305 date=1214345730]
I get the feeling that there is more of an air of jubilation of having missed death (which I am certain Jason is feeling!) as opposed to a sobering assessment of what happened and a real warning. ...
...These things aside, I think the more important posts have been overlooked:
Sky: "And Jason, you already know that I have a lot of love for you and...
Teleskichica, you have great wisdom! Very, very well written.
It's called stoked to be on a "permanently retired kick" gasoline! ;D
These may not be the right words, but in reading this, I am compelled to post my three cents.
I get the feeling that there is more of an air of jubilation of having missed death (which I am certain Jason is feeling!) as opposed to a sobering assessment of what happened and a real warning. In the end of the initial post, it is also said that we can "hide under our beds" or choose extreme unexplored vistas. (my gross paraphrase of the actual statement) That is too...
I get the feeling that there is more of an air of jubilation of having missed death (which I am certain Jason is feeling!) as opposed to a sobering assessment of what happened and a real warning. In the end of the initial post, it is also said that we can "hide under our beds" or choose extreme unexplored vistas. (my gross paraphrase of the actual statement) That is too...
COOL!!!!!!!!! The video was good for my convalescening (sp?Help).
Did it again this a.m., left 4 xing 8:30 a.m. Snow nice & solid all the way up. this time I could see the fracture line extended all around the corner practically to Anvil Rock. Skied down is nice soft-ice topped corn; ice kept the dirt from dragging on the skis. Red algae just coming out. Mazama west face was still icy when we skied down it about 10:30.