TR Replies

Wow hedonaut, that was awesome. I've been skiing there for my whole life and never new that. It's amazing how different things were in the late 60s. The part about the Olympics was especially crazy to conceptualize.

TIL that calling the whole area "Alpental Valley" is, in fact, linguistically redundant.

2/23/12 3:17am

rlsg

Feb 4-5, Coleman Pinnacle Circumnavigation

Thanks for the frank discussion, glad every one is ok.

Some things I try to keep in mind to hopefully keep out slides (been in one so hopefully I learned my lessons..): many fatalities happen in slides of 250' or less so I take no small slope terrain trap with a grain of salt; some sight says there are always places to ski safely when the raitings/warnings are high--I tell my self that there are places --localized places-not to ski when the warnings are LO...

2/23/12 3:13am

steveski

Excellent photos. Thanks for sharing!

2/23/12 2:29am

Gregg_C

Feb 4-5, Coleman Pinnacle Circumnavigation

Thanks for the write up. You have done the community a great service and continued a precedent started by Marcus with the Phantom slide. Too many incidents get unreported out of embarrassment. There is great appreciation for this kind of imformation being shared.

2/22/12 10:43pm

Daniel_G

great pictures Chris and Radka!

2/22/12 2:09pm

Jim Oker

Thanks for sharing this thoughtful writeup. Very glad you all made it back. I imagine this must be a bit of a haunting memory now.

Regarding search practice - I've done it most years since about '95 due to going on one guided hut or yurt trip or another where we start the trip with search drills, and even though we do nice full drills that involve multiple burials, group self-organization, beacon search, probing, and digging, it feels like once/year even is not quite enough....

2/22/12 2:05pm

juan

thanks for the link hedonaut, never knew all that, great story.

2/22/12 2:00pm

jtack

Feb 20, 2012, Delancey Ridge west of Mazama

Thanks for the fantastic report, so glad you are all ok. You have given a great reminder to never let your guard down. thanks again

2/22/12 1:57pm

Not sure if it would work for skis, but for snowboards there are "sled packs" that allow you to mount the board horizontally in the pack so you can ride the sled with your pack on your back. I have one of these and I opt for the horizontal option even when bootpacking as long as I'm not in tight trees.

Here's a link with some pictures.

http://www.backpackgeartest.org/reviews/Packs/Frameless%20Backpacks%20and%20Day%20Packs/Dakine%20Heli%20Pro%20Pack...

2/22/12 1:53pm

bs.

February 17-19, Surprise Lakes

thanks for the post, mack. i had a great time hanging out with you guys even if it was more of a camping trip than a ski mission.

the tragedy wrought by the same snow we were enjoying has weighed heavy on my mind, and it's been hard to work up the enthusiasm required to sort through all those dark, blurry snow cave photos.

but i will..... and i'll be back in the snow, too, though with a heightened respect for the deadly side of my favorite addictive white po...

2/22/12 1:26pm

~Link~

Thanks for sharing. Interesting to see the radical response of the Crystal snowpack considering it received significantly less snow (thanks to the Rainier rain shadow) during that stormy period.

My observation is that snow does not like "rapid change" -Bruce Tremper. That being said, the amount of snow received during the massive dump that we all witnessed can certainly be classified as rapid change, and all the more the reason to avoid avalanche terrain i.e. open slopes...

2/22/12 9:15am

We are always so vulnerable on the skin up. It is an incredible experience I can emphathise with. A few years a go some good friends of mine had a similar thing happen. I can say it changed all of us significantly and the lessons learned from that day echo with me every trip.

http://www.doglotion.com/blog/it-was-going-be-best-day-year

*fixed URL - Marcus*

2/22/12 8:49am

Oyvind_Henningsen

Thank you so much for sharing the account of your accident. Very detailed and well written. We are all second guessing and trying to figure out if we would have made different decisions. For me, I know I have found myself making similar decisions. Thank you again for letting us learn together. So happy you are all safe!

2/22/12 5:41am

JoshK

Thank you for the very frank report and glad you were able to get your friend unburied quickly and ski out safely. Probably going to spend some time practicing with the beacon this weekend...

2/22/12 5:17am

flowing alpy

the reward is being able to ride again

2/22/12 4:56am

VerticallyInclined

This TR should be stickied with "READ THIS FIRST" in the title.

Thank you for sharing your rather humbling story. I'm very stoked that you all got out physically uninjured. I hope you can get your ski game back on soon with a hard lesson for you (and all of us) as a reminder on why we practice snow safety.

Thank you for sharing.

2/22/12 4:39am

jimmyjam

My heart raced while reading this. I am happy that you and your group can ski another day.

Your inward reflection on your experience is refreshing. I hope everyone reading your report will learn from your experiences, practice their beacon skills more, and think twice about venturing into questionable situations. The courage to say, "no, it's not worth it" should be rewarded more often.

Thank you again for sharing.

2/22/12 3:41am

jdclimber

Thank you for posting up and for your frankness and honesty. I know that there has been much speculation about the heuristics involved in the Stevens tragedy and I hope that when the time is right, some of those involved will share their thoughts in the way you have shared yours. I appreciate you publishing this account while avalanches and group dynamics are fresh on everyone's mind.
I am glad that you guys all made the round trip.
Like Scotsman, I have not spent much time in...

2/22/12 3:34am

Koda

I am thankful everyone made it out unharmed. Thank you for posting this detailed report, it highlights many valuable details like group exposure. I also agree about being in familiar terrain and this brings that element in the spotlight. It's important to keep all the elements of avalanche awareness up front on every tour.
Thank you again for sharing.

2/22/12 3:15am

ryanl

Thank you for this- very informative. I can tell from your writing that you were close to if not in panic mode while searching for P. Nice job of holding it together. You're a good partner.

2/22/12 3:08am

Pete A

very glad y'all made it through that unharmed.

i imagine it was tough to put this report together and post it for the community to read & review..... thanks for doing it though, there are definitely lessons that everyone can learn from it.

author=pabloson link=topic=23827.msg100872#msg100872 date=1329935946">
What I have been hearing a lot this week from the media and from skiers are the phrases: 'we've skiied...

2/22/12 2:58am

pabloson

Thanks for providing this public service with the analysis of your mistakes. We can all continue to learn and be reminded of the basics.

What I have been hearing a lot this week from the media and from skiers are the phrases: 'we've skiied this slope many times' or 'skiers were very familiar with the area'. I know this can create a sense of security that may not be accurate. Simply being familiar with an area, psychologicall...

2/22/12 2:39am

gravitymk

Excellent report as well as conclusions, thank you for sharing.
I'm glad that you all made it out OK.

2/22/12 2:07am

Joedabaker

Oh man....
Great detailed report, I can sense the anxiety from my own experiences.
After the 1st slide that forced your group in the hole is when I would have been nervous. I hate the bottom of Union...one of the biggest traps out there.

We ran across a large, 1ft plus deep north facing fracture at Crystal that was sympathetically activated by skiers traversing on the slope 20 ft above.
We analyzed the hangfire and it was sitting on a hoar frost layer or depth hoar on...

2/22/12 2:05am

Scotsman

Yikes... glad you are OK.
I've always avoided that area every since we lost the three guys, Kevin, Devlin and Philip....just a bad vibe in that area and I don't like it.
An avy while skinning has always been one of my fears as my toes are locked in my dynafits and I feel I have less ability to try and get out and have potential anchors on my feet.

Good reminder to observe good skinning and spacing protocol.
I salute you for your frankness and honesty in the ab...

2/22/12 1:32am

yikes. hard to believe we were one ridge over from you while all this went down. scary indeed.

i need to go to some deep breathing and reflection now.

thanks for the report, z.

-mc

2/22/12 1:01am

ron j

ditto...
Thanks zenom.
I really appreciate your taking together the detailed version of your mishap... especially the decision making processes. I think many will benefit from that brave and selfless effort.
Glad you're all still with us.

2/21/12 11:35pm

Marcus

Feb 19-20, 2012, Sasse Ridge

Terrifying. Thanks for sharing the details Zeno and glad you guys are all okay.

The location of the first slide looks pretty close to where Kevin, Phillip and Devlin were found in June '09. I kicked off a similar slab on that same roll a few years back.

I'm probably going to link to this thread from the Weak Layers area to folks can find it easily down the road, if you don't mind.

2/21/12 11:30pm

Larry_R

author=hyakSS link=topic=23819.msg100834#msg100834 date=1329890400]
... Do you ever go up the road to Sasse mt trail that is just past the Last restort? DAN

Thanks Dan,

No, I've not been up that road. If it's the one I'm thinking of, it's more or less a standard snomobile route. A bit farther down the road is the route to Hex Mountain, which you can spot by the signed and plowed parking area on the...

2/21/12 10:31pm

JimD

Thanks for the frank analysis.

2/21/12 9:22pm

Stugie

author=Amar Andalkar link=topic=23827.msg100844#msg100844 date=1329896961]
Thanks for the frank, detailed report and photos. Scary stuff. Glad that you're all alive, safe, and uninjured.

Ditto Amar. Pretty humbling, given the outcomes for the rest of that day. Good work looking out for each other.

2/21/12 3:55pm

Amar Andalkar

Feb 19-20, 2012, Sasse Ridge

Thanks for the frank, detailed report and photos. Scary stuff. Glad that you're all alive, safe, and uninjured.

2/21/12 3:49pm

hyakSS

Always love seeing your TRs. I always try and figure where you are by the pics... Do you ever go up the road to Sasse mt trail that is just past the Last restort? I went up that a couple of weeks back just trying to get a lay of the land.
DAN

2/21/12 2:00pm

rlsg

NICE!!!

2/21/12 9:52am

pabloson

Feb 20, 2012, Delancey Ridge west of Mazama

Thanks for the info.

Looking at Google Earth and Topo it seems like there would be some good turns off the back side too (east side of the ridge).

2/21/12 8:44am

Marcus

There's also a ton of info on snowmobile mods/tips etc. over at WildSnow.com:

http://www.wildsnow.com/category/snowmobile-backcountry-skiing/

Thanks for the TR -- sounds like a great first BC trip with your boy.

2/21/12 8:16am

Marcus

Feb 19-20, 2012, Sasse Ridge

Hey Larry! Thanks for the PM -- sickness and other events conspired to keep me from trying to catch up to you two on Monday. Great pics :)

2/21/12 7:24am

OldHouseMan

I've skied this area twice over the last couple years, both times on a deep snowpack. The first time we simply parked along Hwy 35 where the Hwy crosses Hell Roaring Creek and went straight up the creek drainage. If the snowpack is deep this is a very direct route with very little route finding. Last season we parked at the Pocket Creek Sno-Park and approached via Gunsight Ridge, this route is very easy, but much longer.

Great photos of a great area.

2/21/12 6:03am

hedonaut

Feb 11-18, 2012, Campbell Icefield Chalet

;)

Early trip reports suggest the "overcrowding" is long in the making.

2/21/12 5:43am

dkoelle

I met the owner whilst up at a "worK" conference at Banff maybe 2 years ago. Very nice guy, I think his name is Larry. He seemed quite young but very experienced as a guide, businessman and also general contractor. He described paying heli companies to ferry stuff in during the summer so he could do construction. This place is an example of an interesting business niche. They also have a summer hiking and climbing instruction season I think. I was lu...

2/21/12 4:17am

Koda

author=pabloson link=topic=23801.msg100788#msg100788 date=1329852585]
Ambitious! Way to go.

I was thinking about doing this, but heading up Gumjuwac Trail (my map calls it Lookout Mnt trail) and then doing laps on the clearcut off the saddle down into Hellroaring creek. I guess we would still hit the terrible bushwhack on the way home, but wondering what you think of this approach?

tx

The Lookout Moun...

2/21/12 4:08am

pabloson

Feb 11-18, 2012, Campbell Icefield Chalet

Ambitious! Way to go.

I was thinking about doing this, but heading up Gumjuwac Trail (my map calls it Lookout Mnt trail) and then doing laps on the clearcut off the saddle down into Hellroaring creek. I guess we would still hit the terrible bushwhack on the way home, but wondering what you think of this approach?

tx

2/21/12 3:29am

danpeck

Wow. So, I'm new to the NW, not to mention Canada. How does one begin to make a reservation for such a fine place?

2/21/12 2:01am

VerticallyInclined

Feb 13 thru 16, MRNP, Crystal Peak and More

Too much fun. I'd kill for a day like that.

2/20/12 1:50pm

hyak_erik

Feb 11-18, 2012, Campbell Icefield Chalet

I don't know about that ski area idea. I heard that Jim and Lou Whittaker hiked that mountain and decided it was too steep to ski...

2/20/12 12:22pm

larry's sister

This looks like a real paradise and such good weather! Gorgeous scenery. Brings back fond memories of skiing in places like that. Not anymore for these old bones. We were happy to make it up 700' to our new "low" campsite on Sasse Ridge yesterday in all the fresh new snow.

2/20/12 11:55am

February 19 , 2012, Thar peak Coquihalla highway

author=josborne link=topic=23807.msg100738#msg100738 date=1329793233]
Thank you so much for your report."So we bailed." It shows strength and skill to make the decision to pull the plug and get home safe, and glad you did, and took the time to post it. Cheers

Our crew is pretty cohesive and there isn't any group dynamic things that get in the way of making decisions like that. We have bailed lots over the years and...

2/20/12 11:44am

josborne

February 19 , 2012, Thar peak Coquihalla highway

Thank you so much for your report."So we bailed." It shows strength and skill to make the decision to pull the plug and get home safe, and glad you did, and took the time to post it. Cheers

2/20/12 11:00am

stoudema