Snomo in couloir

WMC members are skitourers and initiated discussion here on a self-powered skier website to enlist support and comment from skiers with similar concerns.

The WMC Proposal from the start asked for USFS management of the unregulated, un-designated, unstudied offroad snowmobile use in the area of the pristine Wenatchee Mountains crest. The WMC Proposal became three with varying amounts of areas asked to be made as non-winter non-motorized, out of consideration of input by newtrout, snowmobile-assist skiers, and others.

WMC has arranged for a State Rep to host a meeting, a person who sold snowmobiles and does not support WMC. The Forest Supervisor asked to be involved in such a meeting. newtrout and others have for a year simply tried to interrupt this conversation, have feigned interest in decent discussion and some have falsely stated a meeting as discussed was forthcoming.

WMC is persistent at attempting to convince USFS land managers to overcome their favor of snowmobile recreation and reasonably manage the winter Forest in consideration also of other users- winter non-motorized users. Many skiers, snowshoers, winter non-motorized Forest users have given input to WMC.

Wenatchee Mountains Coalition is working to convince land managers in USFS to manage winter recreation and winter travel, meaning manage the unmanaged snowmobile freeforall. Wilderness trespass by snowmobiles is also common on the Wenatchee and sadly in many Forests, another symptom of a lack of reasonable management anf enforcement of winter motorized travel on the Forest.  www.justgetout.net/Wenatchee/21163

Thank you skiers for making your voice heard!

WMC reports that Wilderness trespass is a common 'rampant' problem.  I'm not sure that I agree.  I guess it depends on your definition of 'rampant'.  Granted, my data set is limited, which I is why I am anxious to hear from those of you that visit the area more frequently than I.  If the problem is 'rampant', why does WMC continue to post photos and reports from several years ago, and why is he digging through public Youtube videos from three years ago for evidence?  It would seem to me that he should be presenting his own photo evidence from his frequent trips along the Teanaway crest.

I would love to sit down and discuss these issues with the USFS,  and work toward a solution that puts reasonable guidelines on motorized and non-motorized winter use; but I won't do it with WMC as a 'facilitator'.  I simply don't trust him.

This is what is wrong with the current discussion.
IMO WMC embellishes information that can be inflammatory to their target audience in the interest creating more leverage for their cause. The use of tools such as padded statistics, semantics and rhetoric may help to win support for their agenda, however it also divides user groups into distinct opposing sides, furthers misunderstanding and stereotypes and in general a culture of distrust between user groups.

Wenatchee Mountains Coalition is working to convince land managers in USFS to manage winter recreation and winter travel, meaning manage the unmanaged snowmobile freeforall. Wilderness trespass by snowmobiles is also common on the Wenatchee and sadly in many Forests, another symptom of a lack of reasonable management anf enforcement of winter motorized travel on the Forest. www.justgetout.net/Wenatchee/21163

Interesting ongoing discussion on the TR " May 29, 2011, Mt Baker, Easton Above the Clouds"-
www.turns-all-year.com/skiing_snowboardi...87.msg90275#msg90275

Quote from: Lowell_Skoog on Today at 07:30:14 AM

... I object to snowmobiles not because of my ideology but because of my senses. When I go to the mountains, there are certain things that I value, and these things are revealed to me through my senses. The problems I have with snowmobiles are revealed the same way.

I value silence when I go to the mountains. Snowmobiles disrupt the silence with their high-pitched whining.

I value the sight of nature. Snomobiles have an unequalled ability to mark up the landscape. Admiring a mountain covered by snowmobile tracks is like admiring a painting covered with graffiti.

I value the smell of spring. When snowmobiles pass me I instead get the smell of motor oil and exhaust.

I value the feel of natural snow when I ski on it. Snowmobile tracks alter the snow so it feels like skiing over railroad tracks.

I value the sense of space that I feel in the mountains. This sense develops from the time and effort it takes me to get there. When I awake at a campsite after a day spent climbing and I'm visited before breakfast by snowmobilers who had their morning coffee in town, my sense of space is destroyed.

To say that ideology drives my objections to snowmobiles is really clueless. It's my senses that bother me. Maybe you need to get off the machine and let your senses clear in order to understand. (end quote)


Good words. Lowell. Likely common ideas to most backcountry skiers, another example here-
www.nwhikers.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7991439

Perhaps skiers with concerns could please step up and speak up about their concerns and assert their legitimate use of the Forest, quiet, winter non-motorized recreation. On the Mt. Baker District contact the Winter Rec Manager Otis Allen 360 854-2610, email oallen@fs.fed.us

Please stop deleting older posts and re-posting the same content to keep it at the end of the thread. Thanks.

If we are going to quote, let's not be selective about it...

[Quote from: WMC on Yesterday at 04:50:57 PM
"Park Butte LO & Rage Against the Machine(s), June 3-5, 2011"]

www.nwhikers.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7991439

"All hell broke loose by 10:30 as machines crossed the Wilderness boundary    300m away to park just below the LO. One would have parked right up to the railing had I not been sitting on the snow reading (almost runn’d me over).  This went on till 5p, nonstop, posse after posse riding up, smokes & beers…  "

" for 40 hours of silence and fresh air all I had to endure was 6.5 hours of shrieking machines and 2 stroke exhaust  ; not much worse ( but worse none-the-less) than hanging out on a downtown Seattle street corner at rush-hour.  Throw in the spectacular accommodations and call it a deal I say!  "


From the same post that Randonee posted above.

Nice folks though; I enjoyed chatting with most of them.  I learned a lot about their machines (2 stroke, 4 stroke, turbo, 5000-$20,000 machines) and why it is such a special area to ride} 

.

And

So Park Butte was it for me, right in the middle sno-mo country.  I resolved to be at peace with the bargain; for a sunny weekend on a summit I would just have to suck some fumes and trade away any expectation of quiet.  }

Seemed he knew what to expect  but wanted to do it anyway and then complain about it.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 05:04:31 PM by Scotsman » Report to moderator     Logged

Thanks. I believe that posting TAY is required to be directed at the topic and that personal attacks are not allowed. WMC attempts to follow this and we appreciate that the discussion is required to be about the topic and is not permitted to be directed at the individual.