WMC Update 2012

a cultural thing.

A slightly low blow?

Well played though.

Also, Mr. Scotsman, I think that you may appreciate how one can get fired up in return, especially in response to a nasty or threatening message to oneself or one's home.

Trust me WMC I understand your fears regarding nasty comments and people getting fired up. As you can tell, I have a lot of views not shared by my fellow TAYers and I get my fair share of hate mail both public and private. It's easy to fall into the trap that everybody that doesn't agree with you is both wrong and a "hater" as a result and that they should shut up and go elsewhere.
However, you have been a good debater and even got me to concede ( as the record shows) some points in your favor after a good probing debate. Have you convinced me to write a letter and support your cause. No. Why?

Well, I agree with Lowell that you are showing a real lack of moral courage in keeping yourself so anonymous and not helping your cause one bit. Your references to maybe we'll show the map, maybe we won't are fairly silly.  My e-mail address is on my profile, my real name, Chris Willis also fairly well know to all. I have been called many names by TAYers,( and called equally many back) some in front of my wife and family by those that disagree with my views. I've had threats of violence ( and threatened violence in return... I'm no saint) Does it bother me... yes, at times but it doesn't scare me. You want both... people to listen to you, be convinced by you and be galvanized into action while remaining anonymous. Perhaps you think of yourself as "the Dark Knight" of non-motorized advocacy. I think you may be a bit of a coward as well.

you Americans seem more and more disposed to dogma and sound bites....

Hmm... you almost had me with all the griping about the UK comment, and then this! : Makes the comments about racism etc. on the prior page seem pretty funny.

At any rate, Lowell made some good comments about WMC likely needing to build a more compelling case. The WTA has done a good job of protecting some areas by publishing guides to cool hikes to highlight what was at stake. Telling abstract stories of the fun you've had, somewhere in the hills, likely stirs you and the folks you've shared the good times with. I'm less ocncerned with whether you name yourself, though it woudn't hurt either.

Hmm... you almost had me with all the griping about the UK comment, and then this! : Makes the comments about racism etc. on the prior page seem pretty funny.

At any rate, Lowell made some good comments about WMC likely needing to build a more compelling case. The WTA has done a good job of protecting some areas by publishing guides to cool hikes to highlight what was at stake. Telling abstract stories of the fun you've had, somewhere in the hills, likely stirs you and the folks you've shared the good times with. I'm less ocncerned with whether you name yourself, though it woudn't hurt either.

Its called sarcasm ....and retaliation. You should look it up and educate yourself Oker! We minorities will no longer take your bigotry and insults lying in the whipping rack while quietly absorbing your barbed lashes because we refused to kowtow to your slavish views and accept the tyranny of the majority.

Brit, Scotsman, I'm not promoting any sort of activist agenda. As I said, I think Aaron was using a poor argument to try to understand for himself why it was that you disagreed with WMC's position. I've pulled one of his posts already, when he was stirring it up with Scotsman. I was hoping that would be the end of it, but I should know better. From my perspective, you're taking an opportunity to stir up shit, just because you can.

This thread exists not so much because I love the cause, but because I think it's a topic that merits quality debate among people of varied opinion. Clearly there are many here, and the fact that Ruff and Yammadog have been willing to come in and discuss the issue has been excellent. I'd love it if this derail didn't waste all that effort.

Take it to PMs if you feel you need to have it out with Aaron (or anyone else), but please don't do it here. That's to everyone -- Lowell, Jim, Scotsman, Brit, Aaron.

I'm too exhausted to argue at the moment...so I'll just sit and watch.