Snomo in couloir

Posting a three year old video that highlights the poor behavior of a minority (in the comment section) is inflammatory at best WMC... As someone who also rides on occasion, I am disgusted by the tone and language used in the remarks. However we both know it goes both ways, eh? Why not also post some poor behavior on the other side of the line to show the whole picture?

As for the video it's self. Those folks are climbing in an area where there is posted, legal access for sleds (second vid). This isn't a secret, they could have chose to summit in one of the many locations where sleds are not allowed.

Posting a three year old video that highlights the poor behavior of a minority (in the comment section) is inflammatory at best WMC... As someone who also rides on occasion, I am disgusted by the tone and language used in the remarks. However we both know it goes both ways, eh? Why not also post some poor behavior on the other side of the line to show the whole picture?

As for the video it's self. Those folks are climbing in an area where there is posted, legal access for sleds (second vid). This isn't a secret, they could have chose to summit in one of the many locations where sleds are not allowed.

Thanks for discussion and for bringing in views that are held by others as well.

Simply to say anything on the topic inflames some on various sides of the issue. Indeed, a passionate discussion.

There is quite a lot of indication from many sources that there is a significant volume of snowmobile Wilderness trespass- that is why various material gets posted. USFS does not go up there on a regular basis, and by some USFS manger's words, cannot and will not do not do much about monitoring or enforcing the Wilderness in this situation.

The Baker vid is to further the discussion of 'sharing' even when done lawfully.

True your comment about choosing pedestrian travel in an area without snowmobiles. That is the reason that WMC and many other associated advocates work toward management of snowmobiles. There is management of snowmobiles on Mt Baker to some degree, boundaries are drawn.

In the area of the WMC Proposal snomos track the summits from Mission Ridge to Van Epps and Scatter. We have asked whether all or some portion of that could be made non-motorized in winter. Many skiers support the entire crest as non-motorized, some are less specific but want some management, some are very much against snowmobiles. WMC has created the three Proposals, different areas to be made non-motorized, as a result of the various viewpoints.

Thanks for discussion.

Great to see some interest and passion. This is a difficult discussion and advocacy. Even those with frustration at the situation often seem to just drop it after a few sharp comments.

This is a very interesting commercial video of snomo riding and filming at Navaho Peak (spelled per the map here) on the Teanaway/Ingalls divide Wilderness Boundary-

Often there is talk about sharing and respecting others, interesting video here of sharing. Check out the commentary-

Skiers,' snowshoers,' and winter hikers/ campers,' calm but determined voices are needed in asking USFS to manage snowmobiles on the Forest.

Thanks.

Almost all of the riding in the Navaho video was inside the Alpine Lakes Wilderness, I'm sure it was just a few "bad apples" though. :

I'm not convinced that the WMC proposed areas are appropriate for banning sleds.  I don't tour a lot there but my perception is that these areas are used a lot by snowmos and only lightly to moderately by skiers.  There is a sno-park and the terrain is good for machine use.

On the other side, there is the opportunity for wilderness trespass since much of it borders Alpine Lakes.

Why should skiers take precedence here?  Are there nearby areas with similar terrain that would stay open to sleds?  How much of an imposition would regular snowo users consider the loss of these areas to be?

I am thinking of petitioning the USFS for a ban on sleds within a 5 mile radius of my current tour.  I'll have to get a Spot so everyone can stay updated. :

Splitter thanks for taking the time to discuss this, good points.

TAY has provided some good input and ideas to this discussion. Thank you.

Not much discussion about how snowmobiles were allowed to take over and ride an entire pristine crest of the Wenatchee Mountains along the Wilderness Boundary near the Stuart Range. A stunning lack of curiosity? We find no plan, study, NEPA process, or anything that states that pristine area is even open for snowmobile recreation. Given the green views of many here, probably green views even of  some stalwart WMC critics, that is a fascinating oversight from folks who live where banning plastic grocery bags is a major issue to save the environment!

And what of the recreational conflict? Plenty of rants may be found about skin tracks- steepness, snowshoers in, voiding in, dogs in, on and on. All sort of commentary about social/ recreational conflict. However, not much discussion about machines of 150 HP up to the special 350 HP snowmobile in the video being considered as appropriate in areas that are used by pedestrians?

The discussion unfortunately has been usually derailed by tangential issues. Supporting freedom of speech would include good-faith discussion and creating an atmosphere where less-aggressive folks would feel comfortable commenting.

In balance, the sport of snowmobile riding could fit in on the Forest in regard to resource management and other users , if there were adequate recreational resource management.

Citizens must speak up and insist on reasonable management of snowmobiles on the Forest to allow for more balanced opportunities for winter non-motorized recreation.

Thank you.

Why don't you try to get finances to have areas plowed out to parking lots like say Longs Pass Mountaineers creek and Trinity. Then you would have more then enough terrain to keep you busy for a lifetime.