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Changes at Mt Rainier -- road closed Tues, Weds
- Gary Vogt
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13 years 2 months ago - 13 years 2 months ago #207251
by Gary Vogt
Replied by Gary Vogt on topic Re: Changes at Mt Rainier -- road closed Tues, Weds
FWIW, here's the park's performance on the first day of the 'enhanced' visitor services (No tweet on Wed.):
Th 11-29 (7:01) Projected 8 am; (8:12) Projected 9 am; (8:51) Open.
There was one inch of new snow on telemetry.
To be fair, quite a few people are probably having their schedules shuffled to concentrate human resources on fewer days.
The relationship between weather and opening times is probably a lot more complex than simply a function of the daily new snow amount. Substantial snow in Longmire can set the start back a couple hours. Push plows can throw it over the bank up to about 3-4 foot deep berms, depending on the density of the new snow and the straightness of the road. Beyond that, at least one pass on each side with some sort of rotary equipment is often required. Above 5K, it's commonly necessary in late winter to cut the roadbanks down with a dozer or the Pisten Bully, so the big rotaries can throw it out. Usually this is done on days with no new snow. Strong winds can drift the lots full even when there is little new snow. Sanding on the weekends can add an hour, but they usually don't sand much if it's snowing or forecast to. The old-time road foreman, Ed Iverson, still lives in Ashford and told me clearing the lots takes about half the time and the rest of the road the other half on any given day.
The early season road berms are probably nearly double the actual cumulative snow depth, until heavy rains. Right now, I'd say they're not having to use the rotaries much and opening times should be at their best.
In the good old days, they used to start uphill with three push plows, as far as they could get. The center truck had a wedge blade and roared right up the centerline at 30-40 mph. It's quite a thrill to ride along and see the huge 'bow waves' flying into the darkness after a big dump. Plows with straight blades would follow on each side, falling behind to clear the turnouts. The ranger would set up the barricades at Cougar Rock by 9 am most weekdays. It was not unusual to open to Narada by ten and Paradise by noon, even with two feet of new snow.
Th 11-29 (7:01) Projected 8 am; (8:12) Projected 9 am; (8:51) Open.
There was one inch of new snow on telemetry.
To be fair, quite a few people are probably having their schedules shuffled to concentrate human resources on fewer days.
The relationship between weather and opening times is probably a lot more complex than simply a function of the daily new snow amount. Substantial snow in Longmire can set the start back a couple hours. Push plows can throw it over the bank up to about 3-4 foot deep berms, depending on the density of the new snow and the straightness of the road. Beyond that, at least one pass on each side with some sort of rotary equipment is often required. Above 5K, it's commonly necessary in late winter to cut the roadbanks down with a dozer or the Pisten Bully, so the big rotaries can throw it out. Usually this is done on days with no new snow. Strong winds can drift the lots full even when there is little new snow. Sanding on the weekends can add an hour, but they usually don't sand much if it's snowing or forecast to. The old-time road foreman, Ed Iverson, still lives in Ashford and told me clearing the lots takes about half the time and the rest of the road the other half on any given day.
The early season road berms are probably nearly double the actual cumulative snow depth, until heavy rains. Right now, I'd say they're not having to use the rotaries much and opening times should be at their best.
In the good old days, they used to start uphill with three push plows, as far as they could get. The center truck had a wedge blade and roared right up the centerline at 30-40 mph. It's quite a thrill to ride along and see the huge 'bow waves' flying into the darkness after a big dump. Plows with straight blades would follow on each side, falling behind to clear the turnouts. The ranger would set up the barricades at Cougar Rock by 9 am most weekdays. It was not unusual to open to Narada by ten and Paradise by noon, even with two feet of new snow.
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- Gary Vogt
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13 years 2 months ago #207356
by Gary Vogt
Replied by Gary Vogt on topic Re: Changes at Mt Rainier -- road closed Tues, Weds
It's too bad there probably are no records concerning Paradise gate opening times prior to last winter's tweets. Even if the park cared enough to keep daily logs in past years, good luck getting a look at them. (Sorry Randy, I'm way too old to lose any more time playing the FOIA game.)
I'm a tech caveman, but it might be interesting if one of TAY's math wizards were to compare past monthly snowfall with monthly park visitor totals for say, November thru April of each year. I'd expect to see an overall declining trend for winter visitation paralleling, but steeper than, the national NPS trend for three decades. Also some sort of correlation between the snowiest months (presumably the ones with the most closed days) and the months with fewest visitors.
Mount Rainier monthly visitation statistics:
irma.nps.gov/Stats/SSRSReports/Park%20Sp...By%20Month?Park=MORA
I'm a tech caveman, but it might be interesting if one of TAY's math wizards were to compare past monthly snowfall with monthly park visitor totals for say, November thru April of each year. I'd expect to see an overall declining trend for winter visitation paralleling, but steeper than, the national NPS trend for three decades. Also some sort of correlation between the snowiest months (presumably the ones with the most closed days) and the months with fewest visitors.
Mount Rainier monthly visitation statistics:
irma.nps.gov/Stats/SSRSReports/Park%20Sp...By%20Month?Park=MORA
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- Andrew Carey
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13 years 2 months ago #207359
by Andrew Carey
Replied by Andrew Carey on topic Re: Changes at Mt Rainier -- road closed Tues, Weds
Rough visual analysis suggests that the park has managed to cut winter visitation (Jan-Mar) more or less 50% since its peak in 1989-1990; also suggests that the winter visitor use/day that the Park used in its PR about reduced access might reflect the winter closure in 2007 and the amount of closed days last Jan for LE, trauma, and S&R and unusually severe weather/avalanche conditions in Jan/Feb last year, altho 2009 visitation seems low, too, and I can't recall why.
Thanks for posting the data, Gary; it is interesting; if I still had my statistical analytical skills and the temperance required, I do some real analysis; as it is, I'm just waiting for the Park to open again or the snow level to drop.
Thanks for posting the data, Gary; it is interesting; if I still had my statistical analytical skills and the temperance required, I do some real analysis; as it is, I'm just waiting for the Park to open again or the snow level to drop.
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13 years 2 months ago #207361
by Andrew Carey
Replied by Andrew Carey on topic Re: Changes at Mt Rainier -- road closed Tues, Weds
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13 years 2 months ago #207376
by Gary Vogt
Replied by Gary Vogt on topic Re: Changes at Mt Rainier -- road closed Tues, Weds
Calling Scotsman! Is there a Scotsman in the house? davidG?
I don't even know how to post the original Dilbert, let alone photoshop it.
www.uclick.com/client/sea/dt/2012/12/04/index.html
The pointy-haired bosses' clothes could be green with a brass badge, maybe holding a ranger stetson.
We could have a contest to change the first caption.
First prize could be Ashford lodging on Tuesday nights.
How about 'Our visitors are staying away because...'
I don't even know how to post the original Dilbert, let alone photoshop it.
www.uclick.com/client/sea/dt/2012/12/04/index.html
The pointy-haired bosses' clothes could be green with a brass badge, maybe holding a ranger stetson.
We could have a contest to change the first caption.
First prize could be Ashford lodging on Tuesday nights.
How about 'Our visitors are staying away because...'
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- Scotsman
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13 years 2 months ago - 13 years 2 months ago #207379
by Scotsman
Replied by Scotsman on topic Re: Changes at Mt Rainier -- road closed Tues, Weds
Here's your image posted Vogty!
Don't have time to photoshop for you right now as I'm busy telling somebody on another internet site that I'm right and they are wrong!
Don't have time to photoshop for you right now as I'm busy telling somebody on another internet site that I'm right and they are wrong!
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