- Posts: 429
- Thank you received: 0
Uphill traffic at Stevens Pass Ski Area
- aaron_wright
-
- User
-
Usually they have a lease to operate a downhill ski concession and negotiate an access policy with the FS land managers. I don't think you would be more likely to get hit skinning up a ski resort than if you were to stop on the side of a run to wait for partners. The ski area should have no more liability for a user accessing public land than any other obstacle.In the case of the Okanogan-Wenatchee National forest the land managers have refused to limit access to the public land. Using common sense goes a long way, most people seem to lack that these days though. In the case of logging operations the FS usually closes roads with active logging and it's illegal to use those roads. I feel that if any public land is open for recreational use, the non paying public should have open access. Of course this doesn't mean they should be able to use the facilities(lifts, lodges, bathrooms etc.) operated by the lease concession.Agreed, but it is LEASED land so the responsibility lands on the leaser, in which case would be the ski area(s). There's enough litigation out there, so why subject yourself to a very potential lawsuit? The probability of getting hit by a downhill slider is rather high in a ski area, especially if you are skinning out in the middle of a intermediate slope, like Downhill run.
I'm not going to go mountain biking up a FS road where there are active logging operations and trucks hauling down the hill.
The responsible party, in this case the ski area always seems to have to make decisions on, "What would the person with the lowest mentality do?"
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- climberdave
-
- User
-
- Posts: 208
- Thank you received: 0
Sorry man, but I gotta call this one out. Setting a skin track on a ski run while folks are zipping down is downright dangerous; I've poached through the Timberline ski resort before (while skinning from Government Camp to the top of the Palmer) and was scared the entire time. People skiing down are not looking for people skinning up and while assending you put yourself in some blind spots (rollovers, bottome of jumps, blind corners, etc).
On Hood you have to stay outside the roped off ski area boundaries to assend the south route on skis or just hoofing it. If you're allowed to skin up Crystal, Steven's, Baker.... what's keeping the hikers, snowshoers or sledders from exercising their "This is my land" rights and trompping straight up to the top of Green Valley?
If you want the pleasure of skiing at an open resort - PAY FOR IT, if not, there are thousands of acres of which to play in for free.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- aaron_wright
-
- User
-
- Posts: 429
- Thank you received: 0
Uh, that's why I said a little common sense goes a long way. Unfortunately, most people lack the requisite common sense to find a safe up track through a resort. Skiers and boarders stop in blind spots all the time on slopes, is it okay for them? As far as jumps go, are you not supposed to spot the jump and make sure you don't collide with any user that may be downhill in the landing or run out zone? Or are huckers immune to that responsibility? I would not want to skin up a busy ski run during operating hours, but some people access back country areas through the resort. Should we deny access to adjacent public land? I do pay for ski resorts even when I don't use them. Where do the tax dollars come from to keep the road open, even if the resort is closed? Who pays for administration of the Public Land? If a private corporation can come onto public lands and alter the landscape and erect structures at a very attractive lease cost, why shouldn't anyone be able to access public land in a safe manner? I don't see any reason hikers and snowshoers can't access public land safely if uphill traffic corridors were defined. Sledding is a different story, most ski slopes do not allow for safely mixing skiers and snowboarders with uncontrolled sledding. A lot of ski areas provide a sledding area for just that reason." I don't think you would be more likely to get hit skinning up a ski resort than if you were to stop on the side of a run to wait for partners."
Sorry man, but I gotta call this one out. Setting a skin track on a ski run while folks are zipping down is downright dangerous; I've poached through the Timberline ski resort before (while skinning from Government Camp to the top of the Palmer) and was scared the entire time. People skiing down are not looking for people skinning up and while assending you put yourself in some blind spots (rollovers, bottome of jumps, blind corners, etc).
On Hood you have to stay outside the roped off ski area boundaries to assend the south route on skis or just hoofing it. If you're allowed to skin up Crystal, Steven's, Baker.... what's keeping the hikers, snowshoers or sledders from exercising their "This is my land" rights and trompping straight up to the top of Green Valley?
If you want the pleasure of skiing at an open resort - PAY FOR IT, if not, there are thousands of acres of which to play in for free.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- climberdave
-
- User
-
- Posts: 208
- Thank you received: 0
Sorry - I jumped the reply button :
"I don't see any reason hikers and snowshoers can't access public land safely if uphill traffic corridors were defined"
I completely agree and if said corridors are established/promoted by the resort - by all means - get you skin/snowshoe/hike on, but when people feel empowered to access public lands by using the resort runs as the throughfair then we have problems.
You can't bicycle/hike on I5 and that's paid for by public funds. I do wish common sense was more common, but it isn't, so we need rules to keep things civil.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- andyrew
-
- User
-
- Posts: 116
- Thank you received: 0
You can't bicycle/hike on I5 and that's paid for by public funds. I do wish common sense was more common, but it isn't, so we need rules to keep things civil.
Actually, you can bicycle on some portions of the interstate, at least where there is not any alternate routes. I-90 between exits 38 and 47 comes to mind. I-5 over the grapevine may be another.
Anyway, I'm surprised no one has mentioned Mt. Bachelor's recent blanket closure for uphill travel. I understand and respect closures for avalanche control, and I also agree that skinning up the center of a crowded groomer is for gapers (but not really any different than sitting or standing in the middle of a groomer, is it?), but if the result of these closures is that we can't ski one of our own Cascade volcanoes, well, that's pretty messed up.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- climberdave
-
- User
-
- Posts: 208
- Thank you received: 0
"These restriction will not apply during the off season when ski operations are not underway (ok to hike then) except for areas in snowmaking or grooming operations."
Not blanket closure, but controlled access and no - someone skinning up a ski run isn't the same as a paying customer who is sitting or standing on the same run (at least from a legal stand point). The resorts have the right to protect their customers and employees by controlling public access.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.