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Apology 12/15/07 Top Secret Clandestine=Dead

  • savegondor
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18 years 2 months ago - 18 years 1 month ago #179780 by savegondor
Besides the valid point that it might not be the smartest idea to ski in a ski area while it is doing control work, besides the point that this weekend was not the weekend to be skiing Snoqualmie backcountry, besides the fact that two people recently died because they did not heed the avalanche warnings, DID ANYONE READ THIS BEFORE VENTURING OUT?!?!

Access debates aside, why would anyone be skiing Alpental this weekend?  So while the following report does not categorically rule out skiing as wise as it did when those two people died, did skiers dig their pits this weekend?  I'd be interested to know. 

OLYMPICS, WASHINGTON CASCADES NEAR AND WEST OF THE CREST
FROM MT RAINIER NORTHWARD-
...AVALANCHE WATCH FOR SUNDAY AFTERNOON AND NIGHT...
Considerable avalanche danger above 4 to 5000 feet and
moderate below slowly increasing on Saturday and becoming
high above 5 to 6000 feet, considerable from 4 to 5000
feet and moderate below 4000 feet late Saturday, except
locally considerable on smooth, wind loaded terrain below
4000 feet. Greatest danger developing on northeast
through southeast exposures mid-late Saturday. Avalanche
danger slowly increasing early Sunday and substantially
increasing mid-late Sunday, becoming high above 4 to 5000
feet and considerable below.

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  • haggis
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18 years 2 months ago #179781 by haggis
Replied by haggis on topic Re: 12/15/07 Top Secret Clandestine = DEAD
Speaking to a couple of folk at Hyak today who said they skined International yesterday then proceeded to set off a monster just before setting downwards. With all the people in the area its lucky nobody got caught.

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  • Pete A
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18 years 2 months ago - 18 years 2 months ago #179784 by Pete A
Replied by Pete A on topic poor choice of a subject title
i'm going to assume that you want a constructive answer and this is not a troll....

it seems to me that you are jumping to the conclusion that every slope in and around Alpental is steep enough to slide.

Granted there are plenty of areas in Alpental (such as International and the 'shots' under the cliffs) that are certainly in the upper 30's to low 40 degree range and very slide prone, but theres also plenty of stuff around Alpy (and all sorts of other places) that are far removed from starting zones and well below the prime angles for slides. 

With careful terrain selection and regular checking of the snowpack that is actually under your feet, it is possible to safely go put-put around the backcountry without having a deathwish on a considerable/high avy day.

just my two cents....

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  • savegondor
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18 years 2 months ago #179785 by savegondor
Replied by savegondor on topic Re: poor choice of a subject title

i'm going to assume that you want a constructive answer and this is not a troll....

it seems to me that you are jumping to the conclusion that every slope in and around Alpental is steep enough to slide.

Granted there are plenty of areas in Alpental (such as International and the 'shots' under the cliffs) that are certainly in the upper 30's to low 40 degree range and very slide prone, but theres also plenty of stuff around Alpy (and all sorts of other places) that are far removed from starting zones and well below the prime angles for slides.

With careful terrain selection and regular checking of the snowpack that is actually under your feet, it is possible to safely go put-put around the backcountry without having a deathwish on a considerable/high avy day.

just my two cents....


I agree. Can be good to get out on the flat stuff. Did you check what was under your feet?

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  • Kneel Turner
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18 years 2 months ago #179775 by Kneel Turner
Replied by Kneel Turner on topic Re: 12/15/07 Top Secret Clandestine = DEAD
Please recognize the risk/benefit analysis. The mountains are not safe....ever. Enjoy them.

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  • Stugie
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18 years 2 months ago #179808 by Stugie
Replied by Stugie on topic I agree with legdragger...
...who stated it perfectly. The mountains are never safe...ever. Enjoy them. With the growing number of people enjoying the backcountry, you will always have people who don't know what they're doing and it will catch up to them. You will also have people with lots of experience and know-how, and that too will catch up to them. Point being, all in all, the mountains decide when and who...not us. So by even traveling there, we assume the risks involved, whether we understand them or not. We can hope that most people who take to the mountains would also take the time to learn about what they are doing, but we can't be our brother's keeper. If people are reading through threads on TAY to learn how to enjoy the backcountry, or posting stuff on here to "teach" other how to enjoy the backcountry, you're looking in the wrong place. Take a class, or find someone who is experienced to teach you.

As for avys, windloading, stability, weather, snowpack, terrain (and traps), routefinding, and everything else that goes into making a backcountry trip a roundtrip, in my opinion we are somewhat discussing a moot point. With all the microclimates found in the cascades, even if the avy danger is "high", I know that I've encountered some people who still know of relatively safe approaches leading to a nice, stable slope, sometimes with 8" of blower pow to slash...yes, even in the Snoqualmie area. As Pete A said, good terrain selection and stability tests can go a long ways.

Personally I did not go out. Why? Malfunctioning beacon...otherwise, I would have been in a couple of short, nicely gladed, relatively safe areas in Snoqualmie area...

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