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Importance of (excessive?) edge tuning

  • MattT
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15 years 2 months ago - 15 years 2 months ago #195090 by MattT
So I'm trying to become more self sufficient...I can wax skis just fine, but I'm a newbie to edge tuning. Been trying to learn via google but its like information overload (not to mention price of all this stuff!). It seems like you can make edge tuning into quite the elaborate chore. I'm not about to buy 5 different diamond files for extreme precion here...and yes I have seen the Doug Coombs Q&P.

For those of us who mostly ski soft snow (in resort and backcountry) with just the groomer back to lift, what are the basic needs/steps? Should I be buying a "starter kit", getting just the essentials separately, etc?

Also, is simple drip candle ptex acceptable? Seems so much easier and simpler than soldering/welding, which apparently is the new standard?

Any advice is much appreciated to simplify the process. Thanks!

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  • gregL
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15 years 2 months ago - 15 years 2 months ago #195094 by gregL
Replied by gregL on topic Re: Importance of (excessive?) edge tuning
For those of us who ski in mostly soft snow edge condition is definitely less an issue than for people who ski hard groomed conditions most of the time.

It's important that the base is flat, without concavity or railed edges, for the ski to perform properly. It's nice if the side edge angle (bevel) is somewhere around 90 degrees (plus or minus a degree or two) and that the edges are fairly smooth (so you don't tear your nice hardshell's shoulder when carrying them). Other than that, most people wouldn't notice an improvement with a World Cup-level tune while skiing in a foot of Cascade concrete.

You can do it all with a 10" mill bastard file and a file card/wire brush if you're fairly good with tools. Might take a little practice holding the file at 90 degrees for the side filing. A gummi stone is nice to smooth the edges once you're done.

A file guide is nice to add precision to your side filing, you can buy them in different angles (or adjustable). I use a 4" Panzer file with a 1 degree bevel on most of my skis. To get a 1 degree base bevel you can simply bend the flat file with pressure or wrap strapping tape over one end (about 3 wraps).

All of this stuff is available from www.tognar.com

IMO burning a p-tex candle changes the character of the plastic slightly and makes it less durable, plus adds soot if you have any color other than black. Better to use a soldering iron or a purpose-built p-tex tool. Shallow gouges will usually not "take" anyway. With deeper damage you often need to cut some extra p-tex out (make the hole deeper and the edges more distinct) to get it to stick well - kind of counterintuitive but true.

Edited to add: There is a video out there somewhere featuring an ex-World Cup tuner named Willi Wiltz that shows all these steps in detail, plus waxing. I believe I bought it from Sun Valley Ski Supply. Might be on YouTube by now.

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  • Mofro
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15 years 2 months ago #195099 by Mofro
Replied by Mofro on topic Re: Importance of (excessive?) edge tuning
The amount of tuning and edge bevels I put on my powder/soft snow skis is significantly different from my GS skis.

GregL is right on with the base being nice and flat for proper ski performance, skis that are base high or edge high are really squirrelly on any packed surface, though not noticable in powder. Don't assume your brand new skis came with a flat base and proper edge bevels. There are a number of tools for base flattening, I use a true bar with a back light to look at the flatness and a ski visions base planar, but a sanding block works too, along with the mill file for edge high or railed skis. If this isn't a task you want to take, shops like World Cup or Sturts or Pro Ski can run it through their grinder for $30+/-.

I like to run most of my skis at 1deg base edge and 2 deg side edge bevels. This is a nice compromise between "grip" and "slip"- at a flat edge and side edge (0/0, or 90/90) the ski will want to catch and stay on edge, making turn initiation and completion harder. Once the base edge is set, it rarely needs to be done again over the course of a season. For starting out, I'd suggest a multi-purpose edge tool that allow you to do both side edge and base edges, with an angle adjustment.

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  • Joedabaker
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15 years 2 months ago #195105 by Joedabaker
Replied by Joedabaker on topic Re: Importance of (excessive?) edge tuning
Agreed on both replies.
1 degree base and side is most common.
2 degree side 1 degree base if you get on your edges quicker between turns.
I run a 2 degree on tip and tail of a real sidecut shaped ski and 1 degree in the middle. I do that so the shovel does not catch when the snow turns from pow to grabby.
If you get the bases ground it takes multiple waxes to get them into condition again, so I only try to get one of those if I have to a season and just keep a light file on the ski every two or three skis.
The multi use tool does not get the base that well for me, but does well on the sidewall.
I noticed that all my 10" files have a bend in them from running them up and down the skis so many times so it has a natural 1 degree.
I like the Beast base tool if I am getting picky on the GS skis. They have those at World cup skier and online. The cost of a nice sidewall beveler is crazy, just find one in the middle range and it will last you a lifetime. Go to Home Depot and get some $1 clamps to clamp the file to the side beveler. I even use them on the Beast Base tool to hold the file.

I would suggest to invest in a good quality P-Tex gun if you are getting serious, no drip and the hold is much better.
MoFro's suggestion on the Ski Visions Base planer is money well spent. You can use it to put texture in the skis also. Often times the sanding leaves some hairs on the base, but the Ski Visions Planer takes the hair off or a nice razor.

There is a lot of info out there, alot of it is testing on your own and asking questions. Can never know enough about ski tuning.

You will find less rocks on the hill when you work on your own gear!

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  • MattT
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15 years 2 months ago #195288 by MattT
Replied by MattT on topic Re: Importance of (excessive?) edge tuning
I guess I just have to take the plunge and have at it.
Thanks to all for the tips!

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