Mt Hood's new Howitzer and Newton Creek Access?

Well I headed up to Newton for turns on Saturday. We were in the parking lot waiting for the encounter to happen, waiting, waiting, then we saw it. A truck driving towards us at the far end of the parking lot. A guy stepped out and beat around the bush to get a feel if we knew what we were doing, and we do. He asked us what our intended route was, and we told him. He then informed us that meadows does not allow uphill travel with in their permit area and that we had to stay out. He also said that they were doing avi controll that day.
Well we headed into the woods then broke to where the cat track usually is up to the creek where we had to hunt a little bit for a place to cross. breaking trail was hard that day, ok I might be a tad out of shape. We stopped short of the first open slope due to party fitness and grabbed one quick lap before heading out. Not a great day but at least we go out.

Now to the important stuff or maybe just a rant. I forsee them being harda$$ on the up hill traffic for newton. What trouble would one get if caught in their permit area going up hill? I have been checking their web site about the avi controll, and I have not seen a day they did not say they were doing avi controll. As far as I know nothing took place on Saturday. No booming sounds, like what I have heard in the past from hand charges. Meadows states that the howitzer will sound very close to hand charges when they discharge the weapon. So they stated on their web site they were going to be doing avi controll and none took place. I now forsee a potential future problem. BC users checking the web site (or just stop checking) seeing that they are doing avi controll, head up out of the permit area hear nothing then next time take the cat track up just like they use to. I will still make the effort to avoid the permit area for one more trip to see if they are still not blowing smoke. But if the past prevails I will be going back to old access habits. If meadows is going to make the effort to put that information on the web site they should be truthfull. Cause I could see them putting a ski patroll a little further up the trail waiting to bust the uphill traffic.

Newton might become a site of conflict between Meadows and BC users where no one is happy and real problems or real safety hazard develops.

I think a way to head this off is to be upfront and honest about the avi controll in the area. In the end Meadows is the one who the people allow to be there. Not the other way around.

Rant over.

Your encounter with the truck drivin guy is just about what I expected they'd do.

I'm in the process of trying to fugure out if their permit allows them to deny access to everyone. If anyone can point me to the actual text of MHMs permit, I'd be grateful. In the meantime, I'm archiving the MHM's avalanche control warning web page daily. That information can be useful for showing that MHM is acting outside of their permit if it's true.

JJS

johnspeth you are way more organized than I. Did not even think to take actual note of the web page. Glad there are people smarter than I out there

What trouble would one get if caught in their permit area going up hill?

As a former USFS permit holder, I think I can answer this question based on my experience.  We used to call the county sheriff when people would abuse our permit area, as well as contacting the law enforcement rangers for the USFS...they are Federal cops.  Charges brought against people varied from trespassing to disorderly conduct, when they chose to cop an attitude with the sheriff or the Feds.  The permit holder can be liable for what happens in their permit area and has to make reasonable efforts to address safety issues. 

I would try to meet the avy contol guys and ask them (informally) what they would advise.  Barring legal action (or interminable bureaucratic hell with the USFS), you probably won't get the ski area to back down, but perhaps you could form relationships with management or avy control and work out some solution to access.  Good luck!  Without some kind of legal action, you really don't have a leg to stand on.  Otherwise, your just causing problems for guys that have a job to do, and you might get yourselves killed. 

Maybe its time to access these areas from a different point.  Or accept the risk and sneak in...  Or maybe find some Spotted Owls up there!

Question: Are they really using artillery up there, or compressed air Ava-Launchers?

-Burns

Info on Avi Controll at Meadows

I am going to start looking for those spotted owls

As for talking to the Ski Patroll this is where to go but we would need a pattern before a discussion would be effective. Have proof of problem and possible solution before starting that talk. I could not imagin that they would listen to us or anybody at this point in the season.

Here's a better link to MHMs plans for the Howitzer:

www.skihood.com/cs/Blogs/Meadows/Default.aspx?PageIndex=2

JJS