Alpental Plea

I spend a fair amount of time on snoqualmie mt and wonder how often it actually gets charged? I feel as if the warning sign is in the wrong location...on the summer trail....and you can no longer read it. It seems as if most skin the phantom direct so a warning sign would probably most useful on that approach. I'm assuming control work is done on the phantom...but is cave ridge itself above the first major shelf blasted? Besides major storms and heavy windloading I'd imagine it doesn't get controlled. How about a board that states control work times and possible locations around the lower lot?

Here is a link www.freealpental.org/ArticleF.htm  This website also has a ton of info on the Alpental development.

Thanks for your reply Gib, this is the beginning of a solution. A red line down the center of the return trail (dye) and the warning to stay right of it during travel might help the issue on shared trail use.

I would like to see something quick and easy to check for Snoqualmie.

I understand why it's done, but I get tired of the old "It's dangerous and you shouldn't be going up there right now" routine in the parking lot.

This is a difficult problem.

If I understand the Special Use Permit, the ski area isn't allowed to limit access. I could be wrong about this, but it does seem to say so. So Gib politely requests that we don't tour at Alpental anymore. Generally, I am in favor of "self-policing." But, in this instance, self-policing may not be the best approach.

With the proliferation of touring gear, there are tons more people with the means to access Alpental when it's closed. With these hoards, inevitably, come those who are unaware of the dangers of touring at a ski area when avy control work may occur. The result - the people with the most experience stay away and those most likely to get into trouble continue to use Alpental as an easy pre-season, or early morning tour.

Plus, it seems excessive to ask that no one tour at Alpental, for fear of setting off a slide on them, when control work is only going on some days.

All that being said, it seems that the best solution has to be an efficient warning system. Obviously, the drawback to using signs is that, inevitably, someone won't see them and go skiing anyway. The drawback to horns is that you have to somehow alert the public what the horns mean for them to be effective. The drawback to a telephone hotline is that, especially for Mt. Snoqualmie, where the message will be the same almost every day, the public won't call it on the important days.

But these are the risks of operating a ski area on public land where you aren't permitted to exclude the public. There simply is no perfect solution. But, there is clearly a problem, and even a small step will make the experience safer than it is currently. The more information the public has, the better its decision-making should be.

Personally, I think signs posted on Alpental Road that everyone must drive by, at the Bridge, at the Lot 4 Trailhead, and at the Shot 10 bathrooms indicating what patrol is doing and (approximately) when is an approach that will enable patrol to keep doing its important work but that won't curtail touring at Alpental when there is no control work going on.

Gib (and anyone else who has the full story), can you elaborate on how the current "card" system came into use. As far as I know, it is the only system of its kind in the country.

Jason, have you actually seen the text of the SUP regarding this issue? I haven't seen anything very specific, but I'm sure it is there. My impression was that they were allowed to restrict access within the SUP, but can not block access to the surrounding federal land (presumably via the bottom of the valley, since that is the only place that could directly block public access). According to the map I posted above, the SUP appears to reach the base of the Phantom cliffs, and would be a bugger to go around. Also, does anyone know what significant difference there is between a SUP and a lease? Is it essentially the same thing?

www.freealpental.org has all of the information on sup's. As far as the legal interpretation of them depends on who you talk to. This battle has been going on for quite a while. Protect your rights and get involved in the solution. Being informed on the subject is a great start. Question authority...thouroughly!