A Gondola to the top of Alpental?

I have no coment either <br><br> But I need help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

To me the most interesting thing about Alpental, and I said this to my buddies while ripping the pow pow at Alpental last Wednesday, is that Alpental's terrain is not typically the type of terrain that is condusive to building a ski area.  But that is what makes it such an interesting place to ski and so unique.  It also makes expansion a challange and looking at their preferred alternative it really doesn't seem like an expansion plan at all.  All they are really doing is adding more uphill capacity for existing terrain.<br><br>I doubt Booth Creek will ever put the gondola and resturant in because of the capitol investment that would take.  Booth Creek is not an "A" player in the ski industry and I just don't think they can do it.  <br><br>What they put in will be the new International Chair.  I really have to question the logic behind placing the proposed International Chair where they have it.  It is really only going to serve lower International and Snake Dance.  It will make access to the "backcountry" easier, however I don't think it fully opens up the backcountry for the simple fact that to get back to the top of the new chair takes two chair rides.  First you would have to go up the expanded Sessel Chair from the base and then ski down to the International Chair.  I think the effect the new International chair will really have is that lower International and Snake Dance are going to get completely skied out. <br><br>If they are really proposing an expansion at Alpental I'd like to see a lift layout they really expands the terrain.  To keep the skiing experience great while increasing the uphill capacity requires that skiers (and boarders) be spread out over a larger area.  Their lift plan as proposed does not do that very well.  It will put a few more skiers in the backcountry but more than likely it will just concentrate more skiers on the existing terrain which will only dimininsh the Alpental experience.<br><br>What I would love to see, and this is a pipe dream, would be a  chair from the base in the vicinity of St Bernard up to the ridge line just east of Pinapple Pass which is identified as Point 5456 on the topo quad just east of The Tooth.  A chair in this location would really open up a huge amount of terrain and spread people out and would provide an incredible skiing experience.<br><br>Now I can just imagine how the blood pressure is rising in all the earn-your-turn addittcs reading this.  All I have to say is get over Source Lake basin.  It is already over-run.  I've been earning my turns for over 15 years up at the Pass and I hardly ever go into Source Lake basin anymore because it is so over-run these days with the popularity of the sport.  <br><br>What I am invisioning is more of a Euro style set up where you can take a lift to the top of all the grunt work where the fun really begins.  I'm sick of slogging through wet northwest forests for hours to get to the goods.  Think how great it would be to be dropped above Pinapple pass.  The options of your backcountry world would open up beyond your dreams.  You could scamble up The Tooth, come down and still ski a half day on the lifts.  Or you could head over to Malakwa Pass for some skinning, you could easily ski Kaleetan and then come back into the ski area without it being a dawn till dusk affair.  Access to Chair Peak for climbing and skiing would be greatly improved and it would allow for multi-sporting days of climbing and skiing.  Not to mention it would also increase backcountry safety because the proximity of rescue in going to those places would be a lot closer with a lift.  The Alpental Ski patrol often responds to accidents in the Source Lake basin and it takes them a long time to get in there and pull someone out.   <br><br>I guess my point is that there is so much awe inspiring wild land in this state that is not accessible (especially in winter) that I would like to see access to it improved.  There is an attitude in the environmental community that man has to be kept out of wilderness.  This attitude permiates down to the industrial levels of our society that views man as seperate from nature and it is that attitude which is making the viablity of skiing at the Pass an uncertainty in the future.  So I say is build it so people can enjoy it while we still can.

<br><br>No comment! To comment on this subject would ruffle the feathers of said individuals, which could lead to high blood pressure, blocked arteries, hemmoroids, and nasal conjestion. This may cause them not to be able to ski. And that my friend would be a sin. And I am not a sinner. See ya on the slopes.<br>

<br><br>What I would love to see, and this is a pipe dream, would be a chair from the base in the vicinity of St Bernard up to the ridge line just east of Pinapple Pass which is identified as Point 5456 on the topo quad just east of The Tooth. A chair in this location would really open up a huge amount of terrain and spread people out and would provide an incredible skiing experience.<br>

<br><br>Isn't that Piss Pass? I think a huge obstacle to putting any lift into that area is what lies below it. The "far backcountry" area is too steep for most skiers, even Alpental many skiers, so in order to have enough accessible terrain to justify a lift they would have to use runs down the more moderate slopes to Source Lake, which is outside their SUP area. I would imagine (someone chime in if this isn't the case) that expanding the SUP would require a whole new EIS, which is probably beyond the scope of what Booth Creek wants to take on. It would make an awesome ski area though. I'd imagine you'd have alot more crazies taking on the face of Chair than you do now...<br>

Yes that is also called Piss Pass and the backside of that is called F#ck bowl which is aptly named since that funnels down into the now infamous Witkowski Couloir. Really there is nothing steeper out there that isn't already in Alpental's front-country. The installation of my pipe dream lift would require very little tree cutting and there would not be much cutting needed for the runs since most of the existing runs (in the Alpental BC) go down established natural chutes and through nice widely spaced old growth. A little brushing of the forest floor in places would help it and would also help limit fire danger in the summer. The top of the lift would be inside of the SUP Boundary so theoretically it is permit-able. You would be able to ski out of the SUP Boundary very easily which you can basically do today and the Forest Services National Policy is for open boundarys (something Mount Rainier NP land managers fail to understand in the case of Crystal Mt.). The issue would be weather or not the area outside the SUP Boundary could be AVY-Controlled by the Patrol or not.

Is the proposed new Internationale lift where the old one was, which was removed due to repeated avy damage? Would the Samminator lift have the same problem?<br><br>I like the "no comment" style baiting. Subtle.

Jim, Good point about the new International lift. It's hard to tell from the proposed plan in the EIS because they only show 200-ft contours. It does appear that the top of the proposed lift would be on top of a minor ridge which may protect it from avy, but it is below the main ridgeline that unloads.<br><br>My Samminator lift would terminate at the top of the ridge line at the far end of the SUP boundary. No Avy problems there. I have it all laid out on a photo. I wish I could figure out how to paste it in here but I spend more time on my boards than I do on my keyboard.<br><br>I' can't beleive no one has really taken the bait on this post. Common....someone?