Whippet vs. Claw - a debate

I have found the life-link claw to be totally adequate in all conditions except for water ice, and I don't really want to ski water ice anyway.  That said, I have thought about getting a pair of whippets for steeper stuff.  I do worry about stabbing myself, anyone here ever done it?<br><br>Ron - do you know where I could get a second life-link claw for my probe pole setup?  I would need the one for the pole with the grey plastic, if that means anything to you (can't remember offhand whether it's the male or female attachment for the probe).  <br><br>To be honest, as much as the claw is for self-arrest, when I don't need it for that I like to hold it backwards like a cane on the approach by shortening it and holding/pushing down from the top.  I like how it feels and feel I can push off better that way.  If I had 2 then I could do it with both hands, which I know I would like.<br><br>edited to add: I belive you can get a pair of whippets with the bottom poles too from telemark-pyrenees for ~$100, which seems cheaper than they are here, although the exchange rates aren't so favorable anymore.

Corey - I too, like using my claws as you describe. <br><br>Much of the time the local shops only carry one of the claws. I believe it's usually the male, meaning when you screw out the lower pole section and withdraw it and look at there is a threaded hole in the end (as opposed to a threaded bolt sticking out, which would screw into the female claw. I don't remember for sure which is usually stocked 'cause I have both).<br><br>I got the other one (more than once) from life link direct.<br>You can get their customer service # off their web site:<br> www.life-link.com/
You need to tell them what you want, they don't show two types of claws on their web site.

I do worry about stabbing myself, anyone here ever done it?

<br><br> ;DAlmost. Once I was crankin' down the Coleman Glacier flats doing about 35-40mph.  I hit one of those sticky, pollenated sections and I went over the handlebars.  I only use one whippet and it definitely broke the skin of my torso, but didn't really puncture me.  That said, if you crash on one, The Claw can still puncture you, just a bit more blunt that's all.<br><br>Despite my close call, it doesn't really worry me much as I don't tend to fall too often.<br><br>As far as soft snow is concerned, the Whippet does have that perpendicular fin on the top edge that gives some stopping power as long as you slam the pick in all the way...my 2 cents.

Sweet Ron, thanks!  I will definately try to get one before the spring touring seson really gets rolling.<br><br>Sam - guess we posted at the same time! Your story inspired a little tangent of my imagination...<br><br><br><br>Associated Press<br><br>Deming Wa - A local man was found dead on the slopes of Washington's Mount Baker. According to authorities the man's ski tracks indicated that he had just completed an epic descent from the summit of the 10,781 foot volcano to where his body was found just above the snowline. Authorities have not ruled out accidental death or foul play but currently they believe it may have been a suicide. According to local police chief officer Wiggins "After seeing the epic nature of those tracks, we believe that the man was unable to return to normal civilization and decided to end it all right there."

I'm going to get a pair of whippets so I can be cool like all the hardcore ski dudes around here. Fashion over function, duh! <br><br>If you're doing a tour where you won't need the stopping abilities of the whippets, why not just remove the pick, then you don't have to worry about impaling yourself. <br>

I appreciate the counterarguments from Lowell, Ron, and Corey. (By the way Ron, you know that I'm no gnarly climber, I'm really just a skier who climbs in order to ski.)<br><br>But I'm sticking to my beliefs regarding the advantages of Whippets. Most people really want one type of grip which works for the broadest range of snow conditions they might encounter on a trip, and that is certainly the Whippet. There appears to be no debate about the Whippets superiority in firm snow. But is there any hard evidence for the supposed superiority of the Claw in soft snow? Even in "soft snow" (meaning snow which is barely firm enough to require self-arrest grips, not very soft snow where grips are unnecessary), I think a properly devised, controlled test would reveal that the Whippets either match or outperform the Claw, due to their longer penetration depth and the perpendicular fin. That's just my guess, which could certainly be proven wrong. <br><br>But in my own use, by far the biggest advantage of the Whippet is its removability, which the Claw completely lacks. I actually install the Whippets on only a few of my trips (although I carry them on most), and even then they are installed for only a small fraction of the total distance climbed/skied. My real reason for this may seem strange to some, but I just hate having any sharp objects dangling from my wrists as I wipe sweat from my brow. (Obviously I want to reduce impalement hazard while skiing, too.)<br><br>Lowell, I think you may have misunderstood the source of my praise for McLean's design. Although Paul Ramer was certainly much more innovative overall than McLean is, the mechanical ingenuity of the removable Whippet design (not merely its hard snow performance) is what really outclasses the Claw. As an experimental physicist, I've designed and machined a broad variety of mechanical components, and the simplicity and elegance of the Whippet design continues to impress me.<br><br>Amar<br>