Feb 16 Crystal Mountain

I'm a bit confused over all the rancor about that traverse from the lower A-basin gate.

1. There is almost always and always has been a traverse across the bowl, and often it is much more heavily traveled from the saddle below the King bootpack or from Sasquatch (lots of folks who don't want to go to the top make a few turns then stay high across the bowl to get above the lake) than from the Lower A basin gate. I'd be pretty willing to wager that few if any reading this can say they've never hit that traverse from somewhere between the Throne and Hourglass.
2. It's not that gnarly a traverse line. Not like it's a goddam cat track or something. Is it really that tough to ski across/over it? It's never bothered me that much, and I'm no badass. If that particular traverse is so threatening to your safety and well-being you should probably be sharpening your technique somewhere besides the southback.
3. I use the lower A-basin gate pretty frequently (with the wife, showing people around, knee hurts, lazy, whatever) and 90% of the time ski the trees on the rope line then over into DFF, but yes, I'll admit it, I do occasionally traverse around!!!!!!!!!! So there. Am I seriously supposed to believe that no one reading or contributing to this thread has ever used it? Seriously?
4. All this talk about it being under slide paths is pushing reason. If that territory is in sketchy shape for slides the gate isn't usually open nor is the SB, nor is the King. If it's too dangerous to traverse then it's way too dangerous to ski Pinball or Brain Damage. Sometimes the lower A-basin gate is closed even when SB is open due to slide risk.
5. LBNL, there's a whole lot of holier-than-thou smugness in this thread. Get over your bad selves, live and let live and have some fun, eh?

Long time lurker, first time poster. .. possibly one time poster.

1. Traversing underneath slide paths is stupid. 

I don't care how many ski cuts were laid, bombs were dropped or people have skied or rode that particular path prior to your traverse; inbounds/slackcountry avalanches are rare but they do happen. See Mt Baker Valentine's day slide.

2. Many who  traverse under exposure have no idea that someone may be on top of them dropping in.  Because YOU cant ski it doesn't mean that others cant.  There are plenty of ways down the terrain you choose not to ski or are incapable of skiing. Please be mindful of that.  Often times we cant see you.

3. Some people ride or ski avy basin at a high rate of speed. There are plenty of low choke points on the King or little Ak that make a high rate of speed mandatory throughout the lower bowl.  When that ridiculous traverse gets set in hard it can really destroy those of us who are nuking the lower bowl because we committed to something you are unable/unwilling to ski.   

4. Someone traversing is going to kill themselves and the poor person who had the misfortune of dropping in high on the king/ little Ak.  I truly believe a collision is imminent. 

5. This discussion may be irrelevant.  Conversations I've heard indicate patrol is as fed up with that ridiculous/unsafe traverse as the rest of us skilled skiers and snowboarders are; it may be outlawed before the end of the season. 

WORK A LITTLE HARDER AND RIDE THE FALL LINE TOP TO BOTTOM. 


   

Cool! More smugness from an obviously rippin' and highly skilled individual! Frankly I agree in principle to the objection here, but this 'I'm better/tougher than you so do it my way' attitude is crap.

1. Agreed, but I maintain that if avalanche hazard is significant enough then the gate or the SB will be closed anyway. I'm quite sure you've never used the high-t at Alpental because, of course, nothing ever slides above that area.

2. True, but as in any skiing situation the faster and higher rider is responsible to ensure he does not collide with someone below, like it or not. Pay attention.

3. How in the world could anyone approaching from above that traverse not be able to see someone on it or at the very least be able to avoid them? If I stand just past the gate I can see 90% of the terrain for 200 degrees. It's wide open! That's like trying to say that a skier in PB can't see someone on the cat track below, but I'm happy for your nuking of the lower bowl because it is indeed quite the gnarly terrain.

4. A collision may be imminent, but if your nuking means you collide with someone it's not their fault, like it or not.

5. Which is fine, but until they do......

GET OVER YOUR BAD SELF!

I have noticed an increasing trend of traversers and beginner level skiers including small children accessing the south back area. I have personally noticed many close calls and potential of serious injury or death as a result of unskilled skiers lacking knowledge of safe travel in this steep avalanche prone area. This has not gone unnoticed by the professional staff at Crystal mountain. I predict a proactive change in policy regarding SB access or more likely a reactive change brought about by tragic preventable accident.  

Keep your self and kids safe!

Oftpiste,Thanks, what I wanted to say but couldn't type last night.

People that traverse the bowl in questionable stability were/are ignorant and foolish. Ski patrol tried an education program, that didn't work. The current compromise of keeping the lower gates closed when tracks from above are needed to stabilize the pack are OK with me, even though the lines I ski don't penetrate the open bowl enough to be unsafe.

People that traverse the entire bowl after the gate opens are just inconsiderate, messing up other people's line for 2 turns on the far side. I've seen enough traverse lines across the bowl from the saddle, sasquatch, or pinball to know that hiking doesn't make you immune from being inconsiderate of other people's desire for an uninterrupted fall line. Also reference recent threads about the traverse line under 3-Way and classes of beginners traversing to, and hiking the King.

Maybe instead of the "I'm more entitled" attitude I see so much of (my skis are fatter, I hiked higher, I skied straighter), sharing safety tips and pointing out nicer lines would help these people learn better BC etiquette.
Or, maybe, we just say if you didn't ski Chair 6 and Southback on skinny 205s the first year it opened, you can't ride it. Then, plenty for us.

I cringe when I see the traverse from the lower gate across the middle of A basin in it's entirety.

Oftpiste (jp here), I'm going to have to disagree with a few of your points (and agree with one), and make a few of my own:

A.  This traverse to above lake E from the low gate has NOT always been there. This traverse has become more and more prevalent in the past 5 or so (maybe a few more) years, to the point that now when that gate opens, a traverse all the way around gets set in pretty quickly.  Before this, the lower gate was typically used to access the trees just beyond the rope, or the apron just below the east face of the throne, and typically ended when you lost enough vert that skiing fall-line to the bottom of A basin made going further not worth it.  If it was still used this way, fine, but going all the way across is a newer phenomenon, and ridiculous.

B.  Skier responsibility code states "Whenever starting downhill or merging into a trail, look uphill and yield to others".  When a skier is traversing across lines from E. Throne, Little Alaska, and the King, (or anywhere else) that skier is crossing or 'merging' into a trail.  It is that skier's responsibility to look up and yield to the oncoming skier dropping the lines from above.  Skiers need to be very aware doing this, but that's not often the case.

C.  I agree that avie danger from above isn't my main concern with the traverse.  Patrol opens the gate when they deem it is safe, on bigger days, delaying a bit until stuff is skied above.  That being said, I've certainly ripped out pockets (and larger slabs), and sent down quite a bit of sluff skiing off the king and throne, and will always approach skiing southback with avie hazard in mind, and I know many others experience the same thing.

My points are as follows:

I think the lines in southback, starting from the top down, from the top of the east face of the thone to the east boundary at threeway are some of the best crystal has to offer.  Fantastic fall line, playful, challenging terrain, often with great snow.

The low traverse to lake E gets you only a handful of more turns than does skiing down to the bottom of the basin immediately after passing the low gate, then punching across from the cat-track out from the bottom of the basin and dropping to lake E.  Or for cutting to lake E on the trail from the base of 6 for that matter.

The same goes for dropping hourglass or some such, and immediately upon clearing the rock bands, hanging a right as high as possible and heading for lake E.  Are the few turns you get higher in lake E that much better than the ones you get continuing fall-line to the bottom of the basin, then heading for lake E?

I think there should be more respect for the fall line.  Ski those great lines top to bottom, then head out to lake E for the bonus turns to the lake on the way out.  Or if you really want the big lake E run, go off the top of the king, down the ridge, and drop directly in.

But please, quit traversing the middle of these great lines.  It may be only one track (not always true, I've seen days with multiple elevation tracks as people diverge higher or lower) but yes, it does take away from these lines.


I really hope Crystal does close that gate.

(edited for spelling)