Tue. Feb.20th, Alpental in-bounds

Seriously, until you have worked on the pro patrol staff at Alpental you aren't qualified to comment.

Sounds like you'll get some real constructive input with that kind of view of things. : The whole "us vs. them" is almost as bad as some Canadian boarder patrol officers I've met. Keep in mind the people on this forum are usually the ones doing it right and playing by the rules and are usually more than happy to go to bat for you when the gappers want to throw down. Your assumptions of my nonassumptions are inaccurate. I don't presume to know the reasons, but it's become pretty routine to open up at 10 or 11 or later. You can say, "Tough luck, that's just how it is here." in which case nothing ever changes for the better, or you can take a more proactive view and ask, "Is there anything that can be done differently to further smooth things out". It's a great place to ski/ride and it's sad to see the downward trend the past several seasons.

Sounds like you'll get some real constructive input with that kind of view of things.   :  The whole "us vs. them" is almost as bad as some Canadian boarder patrol officers I've met.  Keep in mind the people on this forum are usually the ones doing it right and playing by the rules and are usually more than happy to go to bat for you when the gappers want to throw down.  Your assumptions of my nonassumptions are inaccurate.  I don't presume to know the reasons, but it's become pretty routine to open up at 10 or 11 or later.   You can say, "Tough luck, that's just how it is here." in which case nothing ever changes for the better, or you can take a more proactive view and ask, "Is there anything that can be done differently to further smooth things out".   It's a great place to ski/ride and it's sad to see the downward trend the past several seasons.

That's funny, OK... You're still making assumptions, however I will accept that maybe I am as well.
Look, it's not a us vs. them situation. I'm not a "us", or is it a "them" : The point I'm trying to make is that the patrol shouldn't be the target for blame when looking at opening times, and that it's easy to get on a forum and be critical without knowing all facts. Alpental has a very specific set of dynamics that make it unique, this includes a lot of variables not the least of which is area management/ownership. Ask people what it was like when the Moffett's owned the place, or when Mattnich was on staff.

So am I wrong in saying that these types of delays happen far more frequently here than in other parets of the U.S. and Canada? Not from my experience.I was not harping just on Alpental. I feel like the entire issue is one that is somewhat unique to all the Greater Seattle ski areas. I certainly meant no disrespect to the Patrollers at any of these places. I think Plinko hit on something when he hinted that here in the Northwest people tend to just put up with certain inconveniences rather than try to fix something or be more proactive. (i.e. THE ALASKAN WAY VIADUCT!!!!!) The issue probably lies much more in the laps of mountain managers who dont properly staff. How about building some housing for the Patrol at these mountains. Then they could get there in the very early morning, like they do in Tahoe, Montana, BC, Utah, Colorado, New Mexico, .........

No, not wrong...
And actually some of your thoughts in your last post likely hit pretty close to what is going on.

Here is my observation (for what it's worth).

Speaking specifically for the Summit areas. Alpental and the rest of the properties that are managed by Booth Creak on the Pass are in what is referred to as a drive time market. Most if not all the clientele live in the region and drive up from Seattle and surrounding areas. The majority of us standing in line are pass holders, not patrons purchasing tickets at the window. It's just a guess, however August through October probably accounts for a bulk of their "lift ticket" related revenues. Of course holidays and other occasions factor in, however given the low cost of a season pass I think it's safe to say that the bulk of lift tickets are sold on that basis. That leaves rentals, lessons, and food and beverage as revenue streams. Once the season gets rolling management does it's best to maintain an overhead structure that erodes profits as little as possible.

Just a theory, but I think management works hard to lean employee hours out as much as possible. In order for patrol to run control routs, lifts need to be running. For lifts to run, employees responsible for managing and maintaining the lifts need to be present. If these guys show up until 6:00AM, you get the idea... Not to mention that pro patrol at Alpental is not paid on the same scale as patrol at larger destination resorts.

This is a long way of saying that we are a captive audience, which area management seems to have a relatively low incentive to keep happy.

Contrast this to other "destination" resorts around the west, that do everything possible to ensure a satisfying experience so customers leave happy, telling their friends and wanting to return on their next vacation or ski trip.

Alpental is managed by a ski area management corporation, it used to be owned by a family that loved skiing. Back in the day when it was owned by the Moffitt's, the pro patrol used to get the place open, and then if the Pass closed actually run the lifts until employees showed up. By all accounts that I have heard from friends and neighbors who worked for the area through that era, it was a different and (their opinion) better place. I'm inclined to agree. I remember that lifts opened on time and they kept the place open well into Spring, conditions permitting. Welcome to corporatization.